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FAQ
Aug 09 2002,02:02 AM

Vintage watches
Jan 19 2003,09:09 AM

1950?s advertising booklet: The GP story
Jan 19 2003,09:09 AM

click here to get there

A quick look on vintage watch cases by GP
Mar 31 2003,09:21 AM

click here for a quick look on some vintage GP cases, a bit of history and some words about quality

A pictured addition (1930?s Mimo)
Sep 16 2003,12:24 PM

Here?s some addition to the Quick look on vintage watch cases by GP which included a scan of a mid 1930?s catalogue by Mimo (GP?s sister brand at this time):

More or less by accident, i ran into what matches this report nicely:

You can see the scans of the ad in full glory on the case report pages.
This one is a mid/late 1930?s water proof watch case, all stainless steel (quite a novelty then) by Mimo

and here you see the four screws holding the back:

The dial is aged

(and i leave it to you if this has to be regarded beautiful patina or badly stained

). Another view

The dial is very evenly tarnished, which is probably mostly caused by the former luminous numeral. I suspect it had Radium numerals once (of course they are no longer active and glowing), which often leave a brownish patina on the dials.
Apart from that, the dial is in quite a good condition (no signs of rust); that?s a sign of a good case which prevents from moisture very well.

Interestingly, this one is signed Mimo only on the movement. It has been usual practice by a wide variety of jewellers/retailers for many decades to put their own name on the dials instead of the brand; names like Tourneau, Caldwell, Tiffany, Turler, Gubelin and Huber (of Munich/Germany) come to mind. In fact, there are other watches bearing the name H. Horrmann/Leipzig (which was a jeweller in those days) by other makers such as IWC.

The movement is a Mimo/GP 72, a rectangular 7 3/4x11 ligne with "finger bridges" and 15 jewels; not the pinnacle of swiss watchmaking, but a "good movement" then.

This watch was one of the bigger examples then, measuring 23mm width and 39mm length (over the "lugs").
And the last question which may arise is: How does it look on the wrist?
Now, see and judge by yourself:

In my opinion, it?s still a wearable size today.

Hope you enjoyed,
greetings from germany,

Peter

How to set vintage GP?s
Dec 20 2003,03:03 AM

From the instruction sheets in mid/late 1960?s:

Is GP a real manufacture (and why do they use ETA bases)?
Jan 23 2003,11:23 AM

(recent posting)

G`day,

just a few thoughts:

No maker today does every part of his movements.

Rolex is (besides ETA) the only maker to make hair springs, but apart from this parts as screws and springs are ordered from outside. Shock protection (such as incabloc) can?t be made by the makers due to patent infringements.

In a "traditional" sense of making every single part of the movement, i would say there is nearly no manufacture for far more than 100 years.
Since the upcoming of industrial production after 1750?s, almost any maker had at least various parts made by others.

There are many reasons to do so and the most important ones are quality and price.

If you make precision parts, you will have bad pieces or defects in your production. That?s something impossible to avoid (not only in watchmaking) and it?s much easier to control if the series is bigger. If you need only 1000 pieces of a certain part with a few 1/1000mm accuracy, it will be very hard to do them equally. It?s much easier to go for a larger scale production run and pick up the best 1000 pieces.

In addition, production of precision parts require extremely expensive tooling and machinery such as spark erosion cutting machines. One of this can easily cost a few 100.000 US-$ which is quite an investment if you do only small series of some hundred or 1000 pices. Besides, these machines are really slow. Often not more than 10 parts per hour can be done. And you need qualified personal.

That said, making every part in-house may not result in a higher quality, but certainly in much higher prices.
The use of outsourced ebauches like ETA is even more a question of prices.

The GP 3080 column wheel chronograph movement in the "Vintage45" is much more expensive than a calibre 2280 ETA-base movement in a "Pour Ferrari" chronograph, a GP 3200 movement in a "Classiqe Elegance" is much more expensive than a calibre 2200 ETA-base movement in a "Pour Ferrari".

Of course GP can do their own movements, has done so for more than 200 years and will emphasize on those in the future.
They do so because there is a market for these watches. And there are collectors and enthusiasts who appreciate the quality inherited, willing to pay a much higher price. If you look at the "Pour Ferrari" (ETA base) and the current "2000" (GP base) watch lines, the difference in price is obvious.

The development of a movement is reportedly not much easier than a car?s engine. The costs are huge and at least in the 7 digits. And it takes much time: For example, Patek is working on in-house chronograph movements for many many years and still it?s a project. IWC?s in-house automatic movement has been designed in 1947; but the very first examples ready to sell were made in 1950.
This investment has to be divided by the number of movements one does. Making a simple automatic movement easily extends 1.000.000 US-$ investment for the brand. Given the annual production of about 16.000 watches (including all lines), a watch with such a movement is much more expensive than a watch with an ETA base.
This is one of the reasons Lange does hardly any steel watches; a Lange 1 in a steel case would not be much cheaper in store.

And of course, GP?s tourbillons and minute repeaters are in-house and hand made. The necessary parts (more than 100 individual parts for a tourbillon escapement) aren?t readily available. The assembly of those requires experience and much time, not including the hand made finishing, decoration and regulation. That?s the reason why these pieces are so special and "mass production" of more than a few hundred pieces a year is not possible.

Conclusion: Of course GP does provide in-house movements (and many of them) if you are willing to pay for this premium.

And my very personal take: I don?t think every in-house movement is better than a base movement only because it was made in a manufactory. There are many very good watches having a ETA, Lemania, JLC or F. Piguet base movement. It?s not the movement, but what you make of it. On the level of production costs, an ETA 2892-A2 can be $50 or $100. But it easily can be more than $1000 if refinished and detailed by hand.

Greetings from germany,
Peter

(GP-forum co-moderator)

White gold watch cases by Girard-Perregaux
Nov 15 2003,03:15 AM

Are GP?s white gold watch cases rhodium-plated?

Here?s the answer by GP Switzerland:

"No, our white gold cases are not rhodium-plated. Actually, we use a gold/palladium alloy, whose colour is white enough. Maybe that it is a little less bright than a plated finish, and it is more expensive than other alloys because of the palladium, but we have 2 advantages:

No allergies due to the presence of nickel in the metal (by the way, the steel we use is also nickel-free)
No need to plate again after polishing (to remove scratches for instance)

GP Literature: Books and more
Nov 25 2003,01:13 AM

Chaille, Francois - Girard-Perregaux
Nov 25 2003,01:13 AM

to come out soon.

Carrera, Roland (and GP) - Horloger Par Vocation
Nov 25 2003,02:14 AM

The 1991 publication by GP and Roland Carrera "Horloger par Vocation" does contain some important informations about the history and philosophy of GP:

Carrera, Roland - Symphony For An Equation
Nov 25 2003,02:14 AM

Roland Carrera?s book about the Equation quartz models appeared in mid 1990?s and introduces these finely made pieces:

Carrera, Roland (and GP) - Tourbillon Under Three Gold Bridges
Nov 25 2003,02:14 AM

Roland Carrera?s 1983 book about the first series of Three Gold Bridges tourbillon (the spring-detent escapement pocket watches):

picture by theartoftime.com

The Virtual Factory Tour - impressions of factory visits
Dec 20 2003,03:03 AM

MTF?s great tour through the GP facilities, with a lot of pictures!

The new factory
Dec 20 2003,06:06 AM

click here to read about MTF?s visit at the GP factory

The Haute Horlogerie facilities
Dec 20 2003,06:06 AM

click here to read all about MTF?s visit in the Haute Horlogerie production of GP

The Daniel JeanRichard Museum
Dec 20 2003,06:06 AM

click here to read about MTF?s visit to the DJR museum

Some tidbits of GP?s case production
Dec 20 2003,06:06 AM

Click here to get magically transported there

The GP Museum and Villa Marguerite
Dec 20 2003,10:22 AM

click here to read all about it

GP?s art of watchmaking - a pictorial
May 09 2004,02:14 AM

click here to get there

The story of John Harrison (guest contribution by Mark)
Aug 27 2004,11:11 AM

we?re lucky!
Mark (aka MdV aka Radiomirio) was so kind to dig into the story of John Harrison, who happens to be not only the patron of the Sea Hawk II "To John Harrison", but to be one of the most famous watchmakers of all times.
His achievements are phenomenal, particularly in the field of chronometry and high precision timepieces. And that?s, as we discussed a bit below, a specific field of great experience and heritage for GP as well.

So here we go, a most interesting lecture about a great man:

click here for the full story

And please join me in expressing

big thanks to Mark!!

Enjoy!

Greetings from germany,

Peter

The history of the Sea Hawk models - and Errol Flynn...
Apr 17 2005,01:01 AM

click here to get magically transported there

and learn why the Sea Hawk is one of the oldest model lines by Girard-Perregaux.

Cheers,

Peter



By: ThomasM (registered) PM Posts: 11274	FAQ Aug 09 2002,02:02 AM . Respond to this post \|



By: pc01 (Peter from germany) (anonymous) PM Posts: 168	Vintage watches Jan 19 2003,09:09 AM . Respond to this post \|



By: pc01 (Peter from germany) (anonymous) PM Posts: 168	Is GP a real manufacture (and why do they use ETA bases)? Jan 23 2003,11:23 AM (recent posting) G`day, just a few thoughts: No maker today does every part of his movements. Rolex is (besides ETA) the only maker to make hair springs, but apart from this parts as screws and springs are ordered from outside. Shock protection (such as incabloc) can?t be made by the makers due to patent infringements. In a "traditional" sense of making every single part of the movement, i would say there is nearly no manufacture for far more than 100 years. Since the upcoming of industrial production after 1750?s, almost any maker had at least various parts made by others. There are many reasons to do so and the most important ones are quality and price. If you make precision parts, you will have bad pieces or defects in your production. That?s something impossible to avoid (not only in watchmaking) and it?s much easier to control if the series is bigger. If you need only 1000 pieces of a certain part with a few 1/1000mm accuracy, it will be very hard to do them equally. It?s much easier to go for a larger scale production run and pick up the best 1000 pieces. In addition, production of precision parts require extremely expensive tooling and machinery such as spark erosion cutting machines. One of this can easily cost a few 100.000 US-$ which is quite an investment if you do only small series of some hundred or 1000 pices. Besides, these machines are really slow. Often not more than 10 parts per hour can be done. And you need qualified personal. That said, making every part in-house may not result in a higher quality, but certainly in much higher prices. The use of outsourced ebauches like ETA is even more a question of prices. The GP 3080 column wheel chronograph movement in the "Vintage45" is much more expensive than a calibre 2280 ETA-base movement in a "Pour Ferrari" chronograph, a GP 3200 movement in a "Classiqe Elegance" is much more expensive than a calibre 2200 ETA-base movement in a "Pour Ferrari". Of course GP can do their own movements, has done so for more than 200 years and will emphasize on those in the future. They do so because there is a market for these watches. And there are collectors and enthusiasts who appreciate the quality inherited, willing to pay a much higher price. If you look at the "Pour Ferrari" (ETA base) and the current "2000" (GP base) watch lines, the difference in price is obvious. The development of a movement is reportedly not much easier than a car?s engine. The costs are huge and at least in the 7 digits. And it takes much time: For example, Patek is working on in-house chronograph movements for many many years and still it?s a project. IWC?s in-house automatic movement has been designed in 1947; but the very first examples ready to sell were made in 1950. This investment has to be divided by the number of movements one does. Making a simple automatic movement easily extends 1.000.000 US-$ investment for the brand. Given the annual production of about 16.000 watches (including all lines), a watch with such a movement is much more expensive than a watch with an ETA base. This is one of the reasons Lange does hardly any steel watches; a Lange 1 in a steel case would not be much cheaper in store. And of course, GP?s tourbillons and minute repeaters are in-house and hand made. The necessary parts (more than 100 individual parts for a tourbillon escapement) aren?t readily available. The assembly of those requires experience and much time, not including the hand made finishing, decoration and regulation. That?s the reason why these pieces are so special and "mass production" of more than a few hundred pieces a year is not possible. Conclusion: Of course GP does provide in-house movements (and many of them) if you are willing to pay for this premium. And my very personal take: I don?t think every in-house movement is better than a base movement only because it was made in a manufactory. There are many very good watches having a ETA, Lemania, JLC or F. Piguet base movement. It?s not the movement, but what you make of it. On the level of production costs, an ETA 2892-A2 can be $50 or $100. But it easily can be more than $1000 if refinished and detailed by hand. Greetings from germany, Peter (GP-forum co-moderator) Respond to this post \|

Girard Perregaux Gallery

big thanks to Mark!!