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additional dial message

 
 By: DeGeus : March 17th, 2011-13:22
Pictures of a cal.135 Chronomètre which shows under the brand name the notification: - Imp. de Suisse- (imported from Switserland). This used to be a requirement by French authorities for foreign watches intended for the French market. The different and s...  

marking on the dial

 
 By: Timewarp : March 18th, 2011-02:23
Like I have mentioned in my post Zenith in Bombay I understand that the local distributor had a hand in this as in India Zenith was sold through Favre Leuba and in turn through The West End Watch Co. who had put markings on the dial. This also is possible... 

Agreed on the possible action of..

 
 By: DeGeus : March 18th, 2011-06:27
..the French agent in this, however you have to realise that the calibre 135 was introduced in 1949/1950, well after the second war - so in 1957 still relative new. Suppose the agent had found out that a majority of the French potential customers was not ... 

In addition to "Swiss Made" at the bottom?

 
 By: LouS : March 19th, 2011-05:55
Seems a tad redundant, no?

Well spotted Lou,

 
 By: DeGeus : March 19th, 2011-07:48
you do have a keen eyesight! Apparently not prominent or bold enough and too easily overlooked? After more than 50 years we can only guess... best, Ben.

Could it be related to the EEC Treaty . . .

 
 By: Dr No : March 19th, 2011-12:21
. . . from 1957? Switzerland was not a party to the treaty, so perhaps it was the result of a bureaucratic interpretation of the new trade rules. "Imported from Switzerland" might mean the watch was subject to special tariffs; had it been imported from a ... 

a good and clever thought Art,

 
 By: DeGeus : March 19th, 2011-14:08
and it actually has crossed my mind, one of several presumptions that I have brought forward to the present owner of the watch. In 1957 it was the Be-Ne-Lux, France, Germany and Italy that started to work together under this economic umbrella. Switzerland... 

Possibly because Zenith at the time belonged . . .

 
 By: Dr No : March 19th, 2011-16:12
. . . to a bank organized in France? If the private bank Rössler identified as "Dupasquier-DeMontmollin" in his book about Zenith is the same firm as du Pasquier & Co, it was based in Paris at the time. This is purely speculation on my part, as I can't co... 

That is a completely different viewpoint..

 
 By: DeGeus : March 19th, 2011-18:58
..that I haven't given much consideration. But would the owners really wish to interfere with the routine of daily operation in sales department or even logistics? Hard to imagine, even when f.i. turn over, profit or dividend were below projected, that is... 

Let me check directly with Zenith . . .

 
 By: Dr No : March 19th, 2011-19:30
. . . to see if they ever were organized under French jurisdiction. To be continued after the facts have been made clear . . .

another thought

 
 By: Timewarp : March 20th, 2011-02:29
As in the case of Jaeger LeCoultre where LeCoultre were diffenciated for the gold content in the American market, Zenith in the same way may have had markings. It may be the same way to keep the outflow of foreign exchange as in this case Swiss Francs whi... 

My contact at Zenith has confirmed . . .

 
 By: Dr No : March 21st, 2011-12:38
. . . they have never been organized under French jurisdiction. I feel that leaves us with the likelihood that the dial printing on Ben's example is probably due to bureaucratic reasons driven either by currency or gold trading regulations, or, more dista... 

Thanks Art,

 
 By: DeGeus : March 21st, 2011-18:01
for your investigation. It could very well be one of the reasons like you mention - 'gold trading' in this particular case rather remote however, since the watch in question is a steel one. This afternoon btw info was received that the watch has been sold... 

Old example..

 
 By: DeGeus : March 22nd, 2011-02:35
Old example of such a marking. This time on a dash-clock from ~1928....  

ok this is unbelieveable

 
 By: Timewarp : March 25th, 2011-02:50
My friend who owns the Zenith Clock showed me something his father purchased in the 1960's see for yourfself especially the markings on the dial!!! Any comments please we would love them. cheers...  

I'm astonished...

 
 By: DeGeus : March 25th, 2011-03:28
Must have to do with brand-recognition. Consumers in certain countries are much more "imprinted" and thus familiar with specific brands through the years than less known "exotic" ones. Or perhaps local agents see an opportunity for a "piggy-back" ride? Ki... 

Purchased in India or thereabouts?

 
 By: LouS : March 25th, 2011-03:41
Favre Leuba appears to have had a well-established dealer network in that part of the world and sold many brands alongside the house brand. Thus, they would have labeled the dial in the usual position for the local concessionaires. There are plenty of exa... 

inter-breeding

 
 By: DeGeus : March 27th, 2011-03:10
I suppose your first sentence is fully correct. But for horological clans in the Western part of the world, Favre Leuba (Genève) is in the first place a brand name . Can you imagine f.i. a Rolex with 'Angelus' on the dial or Longines with 'Doxa' ? To... 

manufactory v/s manufactory

 
 By: Timewarp : March 27th, 2011-12:09
What amazes me is one manufacturer selling another manufacturer,s products. It is unlike a shop like Wempe, Tiffany's or Gublin but they 'sold' either with their marking or the manufacturer's markings not another manufacturer's. Hmmm need to figure...any ... 

Unique arrangement

 
 By: LouS : March 28th, 2011-14:44
Favre Leuba appears to have had a unique arrangement in India, where they set up a chain of retailers which sold watches like any jeweler, functioning precisely like a shop like Wempe, Tiffany's, Gobbi, Turler, etc. Thus they labeled products of other man... 

india yes

 
 By: Timewarp : March 27th, 2011-12:11
yes seems to be purchased in India, not much info though as the original purchaser is sadly no more.